FARMINGTON – In the wake of the tragic mass shootings at the Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., the debate continues to rage over whether changes to our gun control laws will make us safer.
The public is invited to join a panel of experts from 7 to 8:30 p.m. on Thursday, Feb. 7 at the University of Maine at Farmington’s Lincoln Auditorium as they discuss whether meaningful gun control in America is possible without compromising the strong Second Amendment protections the U.S. Constitution affords us.
The forum, sponsored by Daily Bulldog and moderated by attorney Woody Hanstein, will explore if the changes proposed by President Barack Obama that call for more background checks, an assault weapons ban and a 10-round clip limit will help prevent the next Newtown, Aurora or Virginia Tech massacre. Or, are these proposals just feel-good measures that will change little?
In Maine, many new gun control bills are expected to be introduced in the Legislature, including a proposal to arm teachers and other school employees with guns. Is that the right answer?
Because mental illness has been at the root of many of these recent shooting tragedies, we will also explore whether changes in our mental health laws should be part of the solution.
The Daily Bulldog is pleased to welcome the following panelists for this important discussion:
• Dr. Art Dingely, a psychiatrist who has worked in hospitals, clinics, forensic units and crisis teams. He is also a hunter of 53 years and a former member of the National Rifle Association.
• J. Thomas Franklin, a retired lawyer and president of Maine Citizens Against Handgun Violence;
• State Rep. Lance Harvell has represented the District 89 towns of Farmington and Industry since 2009, and is a lifelong avid hunter and published author of a sportsman’s book.
• Ethan Strimling, a former state senator and currently a political TV analyst, has sponsored numerous bills to enhance gun safety in Maine;
• Barry Sturk, a federally licensed firearms dealer for 23 years and state lobbyist for firearms;
• David Trahan, a former state representative and state senator, is currently the executive director of the Sportsman’s Alliance of Maine.
Any women or educators scheduled for the panel?
As far as laws go, we have all of those we need. Anything additional limits the freedom of law abiding citizens, and ignores the fact that lawbreakers will not be affected in the slightest.
U.M.F panel of experts on gun control got to be kidding me!!!
Yeah,
how many laws did the perp violate in Newton, Last count 27 ??? Oh yeah one more Law would of made him come to his senses. Get Real, The only thing that stops Pycho killers is a bullet in their direction which is what these cowards deserve. Interesting to note these shooter cowards don’t show up at police stations or gun clubs or anywhere there is a remote chance of meeting some one with equal force. Schools and movie theater’s are a safe bet, unless some one is carrying a concealed weapon then they inevitably kill themselves or get killed as they obviously deserve. Criminals don’t usually confer to the law books before committing their crimes. They could care less if they violate 27 or 28 different laws. Every citizen should arm themselves and let the criminals wonder when their last breath will be. End of Story……
Many folks will claim that the founding fathers never envisioned semi-automatic weapons when they wrote the Constitution or the Second Ammendment. Well, of course they didn’t. What they feared was a government simliar to the one they they had just overthrown. A tyranical one with superior firepower. So they created a document that would ensure the prevention of future tyranny.
Our government has three separate- and supposedly equal- branches. They prevent each other from excessive influence over one another. The gift that the framers gave the populace to ensure that balance is- the ballot box. For the past 200 plus years, the voters have utilized that precious right to vote; thereby, ensuring that the Constitution will never be circumvented.
The greatest gift that the framers gave the public was an insurance policy… Namely… The Second Ammendment.. which they created just in case that the government tried to prohibit the populace from entering election booths….the Right to Bear Arms will always permit American citizens the right to choose on election day…If we lose that one inaliable right…we could lose the rest…one by one by one…
Well said, Paul.
“The liberty of any person to own a military-style assault weapon and a high-capacity magazine, and keep them in their home, is SECOND to the right of my son to his life – his LIFE” David Wheeler, father of Benjamin Wheeler, age 6, who was killed at Sandy Hook.
ummm,,,Common Sense poster, the Sandy Hook perpetrator AND his mom were members of a gun club.
My sympathy to David Wheeler in his loss, but the man does not understand the Second amendment to the US constitution. Misuse of a liberty by one man does not negate that liberty for all men.
I find it amazing that the people screaming about their second amendment rights are often those that step all over the first amendments guarantee for the separation of church and state. If you’re going to support the Constitution,you have to support all of it,not just the parts that suit you.
Also,why not have a yearly (or bi-yearly) registration for every weapon,you we do for cars,boats,atv’s and the like? The money could be used the fund background checks.
@ avoice…..Nazi Germany enacted gun registration and eventually prohibited persons of Jewish descent from possessing firearms…We know what happened next
Yes yearly gun registration… Lets tell all the criminals who has guns and who does not. That wont make burglary any easier will it? Even if that information is supposed to be private its only a matter of time before somebody hacks it and posts it online just like someone did in new york.
There is no way the Founding Fathers could have envisioned the Second Ammendment to cover smei automatic weapons because they did not exist at the time. It was written at the time for muskets which was what the government had availible at the time as well. Now the government has fully automatic weapons. How are we to protect ourselves with against tyranny with a single shot or limited to ten rounds when the government had full auto capability? It is our right to have semi automatic weapons in current times to keep up with the government. J. do some looking past mainstream media, the perp of the Sandy Hook shooting had mental issues and was denied buying a firearm earlier in the week, because he wasn’t LEGALLY allowed to. Also if you look further he did not even use the AR-15 the media said he did, four pistols were used. More laws will do nothing but hurt law abiding citizens. I think we can all agree something needs to be done, why don’t we start with more thorough backround checks, along with attaching mental health records to the NICS(the backround check system). I wish I was able to attend this forum unfortunatly I am out of town, but I would love to hear both sides of the debate in an area where firearms are a large part of our community. We need to all stand up for our rights, if the Second Ammendment goes I am sure others will soon follow.
Some great arguments, I hope some of you are able to attend the forum.
I understand the right of citizens to protect themselves from the government, but how does an assualt weapon protect from drones, gas, etc.?
The government is already more powerful then it’s citizens.
Assault weapons were banned under Reagan, that expired, why?
Should we keep trying the same thing over & over again?
Why can’t we know the names and locations of the mentally unstable, so we can watch their activities? Oh! I am sorry. It’s the handwringers out there that protect the mentally ill. So who is really to blame for miss use of guns?
I borrowed a gun and some ammo from a friend and placed same on the floor. It has been several hours and the gun did not load itself nor shoot.
Jeesh, you should research before you post……the ban was under Clinton(dem) expired under Bush(rep)….now we have a socialist so back to a ban…….
Thanks for the clarification MD – my apologies to R.R.
That’s for the correction MD. My apologies to Regan-ites.
Why hold a forum – we all know all the answers…
To argue that we shouldn’t have laws, because criminals will break them anyway, is just about the poorest logic I have heard in this debate. Who told you to say that, Rush or Glen?
So much for the ten commandments, and our justice system? It’s no use making it against the law to kill, somebody will just go ahead and do it anyway?
Is that really the limit of your powers to reason?
The founding fathers were not a group of all knowing sages with infinite wisdom. They had very real failings.
A good many of them were slave holders. In fact, they ducked the issue of slavery when drafting the constitution and in so doing set the stage for one of the bloodiest times in our nation’s history.
They knew that the country would evolve and that the constitution would need to evolve with it. That is why it can be amended.
The 2nd amendment is stronger now than it has ever been in our countries history, esp. since the passage of the gun owners protection act of 1986.
Go do a little research, look it up. It’s all there for everyone, all you have to do is click on it. Don’t assume what you hear and read is the truth, unless it can be backed up by facts, and check the facts for yourself.
Read a little history. Our founders did not tolerate much in the way of armed insurrection. Washington, Adams, Jefferson; they put down armed rebellions, hung people for treason and enacted anti- sedition laws.
Before you make specious arguments about Nazi Germany and Jews, make sure you know your history and know all the facts, don’t just regurgitate the stuff you hear on the radio. The form of government, the laws , the society and the pervading attitudes of the times were very, very different than how we live here today.
As usual a big wordy lecture from Snowball (SURPRISE !!,,,dont faint now).
Does not matter.
The 2nd amendment “IS” OUR RIGHT.
Amend “that”.
Will not be attending. Did not see anyone on the panel that was not PRO. gun..
If you want your children ‘protected’ against all the evils in the world that NO law will have any effect on. Then stand up and guard them. Go and keep the evils away yourself. Stop whining about the Government to save you or for others to ‘protect’ your children. Get a bit of guts and do it yourself. The ruling ellite have paid, armed, guards on their children. It is the only way that works and they know it!
If everyone took the responsibility for the lives around them then stuff like this would simply not happen. Stop expecting the government to baby you for your entire life as they will do it in a government way. We all know how well that works (not!) This arguement about Guns is pointless. It is a mechanical and chemical innanimate object. Without a person behind it, it has no power. It is the person, not the tool that is the problem.
A ban on new guns is pointless. There are over 400 milion out there and more made every day. Limits on magazines are meaningless as one can carry many magazines and reload very quickly. This is simply a political gambit to disarm the public so the rulling ellite feel safe from the unwashed.
The press are pounding their ideas into us on every TV screen and news outlet. To them, anyone protecting themselves is more a villain than the criminal. This is complete propaganda. The press is telling us that we are children and cannot be trusted with sharp/dangerous objects. The government is telling us that we are all children and that they will take away the things that makes us harmful. Grow up and stop whining about safety. The world isn’t safe, has never been safe, and I hope never will be safe because life would then become truly pointless.
I feel for the families that lost their children. They are hurting and nothing any of us can do that will really help. Go to your school and guard your children. ‘Arm’ youself with something and take a stand even if it is only with a brick.
As a Connecticut resident and living one town over from Newtown I can honestly say that by enacting more laws won’t stop insane people from doing something like this again. People who commit these crimes don’t follow existing laws. These laws oinly inhibit law abiding citizens and make politicians feel good. Lanza and his Mother did not belong to a gun club. I am a gun owner and a Maine hunter.
THAT’S ALL RIGHT:
It’s difficult to argue against common sense, isn’t it? Nothing left to say, except,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I love how no one on who shouts loudly for the right to bear arms, has anything to say about defending the rest of the constitution. As long as you have your guns, all be OK.
I’m sorry I write so many words, and some big ones too. It must be difficult to read it and understand what it all means.
It’s easier to just hit the comma key,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and listen to what the right wing radio personalities tell you to think and say.
When I saw 21 comments on this page I knew that the gun right advocates would be out in full force shouting down the opposition. It’s a forum, people, presumably where different points of view are aired. That seems like a reasonable thing to do in a democracy. For folks out there who read these boards and think–my goodness, my moderate views on gun control must be a part of radical minority–I say, no. Recent polls show that a majority of Americans want more gun control but that there’s disagreement as to how to go about this. Reasonable and moderate people: we are not a minority and we need to stand up for for our children and our communities. I, for one, do not want to live in a country where I need to take a gun to the grocery store because (as CommonSense pointed out…irony abounds on that name) the grocery store folks are unarmed so OF COURSE crazy people will target it. Consider that logic: the problem with guns is more guns and guns most be everywhere so that crazy people with guns know that there are a lot of opposing guns out there and will be afraid and not use their guns or at least be killed swiftly by all of the sharp shooting cowboys out there. It’s ridiculous and the fact that people can say it with a straight face is amazing to me.
Also, if I had a nickel for every time someone brings up Nazi Germany to illustrate a point on these boards…well, just think of all the guns that money would buy.
Snow ball
Don’t assume what you red is true.If it was written by the human race there is a good chance it may have some
falsities itertwined
SOPRRY !Thats intertwined
Up to this point, the common sense statements have come from the pro 2nd amendment people. They also support the whole constitution.
The Piers Morgan talking points will be more effective if you loose the condescension, and edit, and condense, your posts.
Easy Does it:
If you read what I write, you will see that I am advocating precisely what you state. Look at all side of an issue. Don’t believe what you read and hear without checking the facts for yourself. It’s not that difficult to check facts. Do a Google search, search Wikipedia, find footnotes, and then check them out. The library of Congress is online.There are so many people out there constantly checking up on facts that false info is usually caught out quickly, it’s just that sometimes the voices stating falsehoods are louder.
It’s easy to take a quote out of context, or use a spurious argument and make it sound perfectly sensible and plausible.
I have listened to that being done on both sides of this issue.
It’s easy to say we all have a right to bear arms, to go to the Maine State house and walk around with a rifle to show you can legally do it.
How about going to Los Angeles CA, walk down the street in Silverlake, towards a dozen Latino men walking towards you, with THEIR legal assault weapons? It’s a big country we live in and a lot of it is nothing like rural Maine.
I wonder why, with so many of the conservative right also devout Christians, they don’t quote this from the Book of Isaiah: “And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.”
I always considered myself open-minded, and work best at reaching towards common goals whether at work or at home by discussing all directions and options before we meet at a common ground that is the overall best solution for all parties or goal that we are trying to reach. However, whenever I read blogs and mainstream media, on the topic of “Gun Control”, or “Mass Killings” the reaction is always predictable that the knee-jerk politicians, the far left-media reporters, supporters and their minions follow like sheep. These observations can be seen everywhere. Oh, before anyone drops their Twinkies and coffee spills all over their laptop and exercise their “1st Amendment”, yes, the far right chimes in also in opposition. The difference is that the left is using opinions, distorted or inaccurate information and false or misinterpretations to push their agenda unto the rest in far great numbers than the Right. Regardless of where you stand, do your due diligence, research the data from FBI reports, read the history of how this great Nation was formed, read the history of other countries and where they are now as compared to us, chat with people that left those countries and ask why they are here. Treat this as if your argument was being tested in a court of law and your life “literally” depended on it. (BTW, remember, just like in court, hearsay, opinions and unsupported data is thrown out). Then and only then you might begin to grasp why those trying to defend and uphold our existing laws are vehemently opposed to those that just cry out to change, water down or restrict them.
Please do not start with ” I always considered myself open-minded, and work best at reaching towards common goals whether at work or at home by discussing all directions and options before we meet at a common ground that is the overall best solution for all parties or goal that we are trying to reach.” and then rail against the perceived opposition.
The problem is we have too many deaths by gunfire in our country, and as a nation we have not had the courage to fully identify the problem and all of the possible causes and solutions, let alone make a real effort at implementing solutions.
By our combined inaction, as a nation, we allow nearly thirty thousand deaths by gunfire each year.
RAISING OUR VOICES and reminding others of our fear of losing weapons with which we must defend our homes against all aggression is missing the point.
We simply have two many deaths by gunfire in our country.
We, the people, should insist of our elected leaders that they fully identify the number of deaths by cause, inform us all of the numbers of homicides, suicides and killings in self defense, along with the accidental shootings causing injuries and deaths.
Give the task of collecting the data to the FBI, or Homeland Security, and analyze the situation with as much real data as possible before jumping to conclusions.
If we need to train people on the proper use, storage and care of fire arms, ok, let’s do it.
If we need to improve our mental health screening and care to prevent more deaths, ok, let’s do it.
If we need to do background checks for all weapons sales, ok let’s do it.
If we need to analyze our society, and figure out ways to reduce our inclination towards deadly violence then let us do so.
Read the Doonesbury strip in today’s Sunday paper. Read it and try to get the point.
Facts are so hard to argue with.
Thirty thousand deaths a year and we have chosen to do too little other then disagree as to how to get started…
We can and must do better for ourselves and our children, don’t you think?
We, the People deserve better from our leaders and ourselves.
People committing violent crimes have time to organize their plan of attack.Even if they only have access to 10 round clips,they will make the clips easily accessible to themselves before they enter the place where they will commit the violent crime.The unsuspecting people that they are after will have no time to gather together ,or organize multiple clips or weaponry to defend themselves.They will only have what’s in thier gun to defend themselves with.10 shots later they are now defenseless and possibly.dead.Who is really being limited by a clip capacity law?
@snowball
I know this article is older, so don’t know if you will see this. I can’t say I see much common sense in your arguments, but let’s look at a few of them. I don’t know anyone who is saying that we shouldn’t have laws because criminals will break them anyway. I, however, do feel that adding more gun-control laws only hurts law-abiding citizens BECAUSE they are the ones who will obey them.
It is funny how you don’t seem to like the subject of Nazi Germany brought up. Did they not have gun-control laws? Did those laws not cause problems? Yet to be fair, Communist Russia, China, and North Korea also have gun-control laws. How’s that working for those citizens? True, you could argue that the E.U. and other countries have gun-control laws and that gun crimes are down in those places. That would be logical because the populace does not have access to guns. Yet America has many guns and also has a lower violent crime rate than Great Britian.
Saying that Nazi Germany and America today are different situations would be only true to a point. “The form of government, the laws , the society and the pervading attitudes of the times were very, very different than how we live here today.” That statement is not true. We, as a country, are moving more toward a government that controls more and more of our lives, just like Nazi Germany. Also, hatred for Jews is seeing a sharp rise around the world today. I know, you can just say that I am a right-wing-Glenn-Rush loving nut job. It is always easier to just call names.
How many kids die from people texting while driving? Or how many are victimized by predators on the internet? I dare say far more than are killed by firearms. I don’t see any movement to ban cell phones or close down the internet because that would inconvenience too many of us. Attack guns instead so politicians etc. can have a feel good moment like they are doing something.
Refer to this website for world-wide data on gun ownership, death by guns, and other gun-related statistics. You can create charts comparing facts from the US to facts from other nations. Some strikingly surprising results can be seen.
http://www.gunpolicy.org/
P.S. The US has more than twice as many unintentional gun deaths per 100,000 people than the next nation, Israel, and more than three times the number per 100,000 people, in Canada
To Mr. or Mrs. “Consider the consequences”
First of all, I did not call out anyone on his or her opinion(s). However, I stated that overwhelming numbers of bloggers and “mainstream” media chooses to lead their storyline or talking points targeting what is on their agenda, using tragedies as their platform, and misconstruing the information. In George Orwell’s oft-quoted and insightful book 1984, we clearly see how this work of fiction has become reality, and in turn how reality is turned back into fiction through the manipulative, inaccurate and deceptive reporting of mainstream media.
And yet you call me out and paraphrase my comments to suit you. I never said or took a position of “inaction” nor did I suggest it.
And yes raising our voices is needed, however, to cry wolf ever time for no reason, multiple times unnecessarily, really is futile. The sad thing is that the masses are too easily lied to and then follow suit.
You also throw out statements of “…many deaths by gunfire in our country.” Is really meaningless if you do not back it up with actual proof or analysis of the figures. Again, you fall under the same category of those that just “Cry out.” However, true to form, I will give you the benefit of doubt. Let say that you statement is accurate, what is your point? Let see, gunfire, being the reason for the deaths. Did the gunfire kill all the people? What is gunfire? Was it a gun? Or a canon? Did a bunch of guns get together and meet, plan and suddenly form a group hell bent on killing the American people. Sorry for being sarcastic or employing satire, but you suggested that I read “Doonsbury.” Frankly, I do not read cartoons for my source of “factual” information. It’s entertainment, sadly, society seems to not be able to see the deference. And if you still missed my point, the media is filled with headlines, pictures and stories with “Evil Guns”, “Assault Rifles”, “Gun Violence,”“Bad Guns”, “Gun Kills…” etc., etc. Last time I checked, a gun is a piece of machined metal, inanimate and without any feelings. Yet almost every media source, politicians point to the “Guns” as the problem, or the clips, and even point at the wrong one as the one used. (Read the FBI reports as the main guns used by “criminals” and involved in “homicides”).
Lastly, you also point out many other “possible” reasons for the violence and crimes committed being from sources other than the guns themselves. Great, but this was in part my point, yet the overwhelming media and bloggers use this only as talking points and ask for laws and legislation in the wrong direction or blame the wrong causes, i.e., “assault” weapons or “large” capacity magazines. There is plenty “wrong” even with that statement, however, that for another debate on correctly defining the parts, words used, etc.
Lastly, if you really wanted to stop violent crime from happening, then enforce our existing laws (we have more than enough right now) and if criminals were actually serving time in prison then maybe you might sleep better. Oh, lets say that the currently law abiding citizen suddenly becomes a criminal because of new more restrictive laws, what are we to do with them? Bog down and further take up the time of law enforcement officers that should be arresting real criminals. Oh, then lets crowd even further our jails and prisons with the new faux criminals. Then lets release the current inmates to make room for the new group of “non-violent criminals” that now need to be imprisoned because of a technicality. As my old professor use to say, “…there are no laws worth the paper it’s printed on, if there is no enforcement.” BTW, that can apply to any law.
I wish Wiltomom would show us all, where she found that the majority of Americans want more gun control.
D.C.
I feel sorry for you. If you honestly think our country is becoming anything like Nazi Germany, you need help.
Just for two examples, they would NEVER, EVER, have allowed an African-American to have any elected office, let alone elect him as President with a majority of the vote.
They also wouldn’t have allowed Jews to hold public office.
They wouldn’t have allowed Gays either.
Also, heads up, Russia is no longer communist. The USSR no longer exists.
There are medications and counseling available that will help you. You’ll be much happier and more relaxed.
For all of you that think our country is on the verge of needing an armed insurrection to “Restore” democracy I say,
take a good hard look around you. Now; go look at pictures from the 1930’s. The gaunt, hopeless looks of the people standing in bread lines. look how skinny they look. Go to Wal-mart now, and look around. You see anyone like that?
Go back again, check out the KKK outfits. Look at pictures of oppressed black share croppers.
Go look at the pictures of the coal miners, their faces black with coal dust, and their lungs nearly as black. Look at the pictures of Mainers, working in mills, 12 hour days, 6-7 days a week, to make barely enough to survive.
The idea, back then, that most people would own a car, a house, a 4-wheeler, a snow mobile, multiple guns and ammo and extra clips, have camps to go to in the summer, have leisure time to fish and hunt and watch TV on HD flat screens. How many of you watched the super bowl on your TV’s yesterday? You think that’s tough times then? Worth jumping up and joining a militia to go change things?
There has never, ever been a better time for humans or a better place for them to be, than this country, right now. If you think otherwise, you need help.
I find it hard to listen to anyone who spouts the bible text as what is right. It was written by men who were probably insane themselves, they did hear voices, not god himself.
Doesn’t it also say, “An eye for an eye”?
As far as the first amendment goes,
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Anyone disagree with that? I don’t, nor do I disagree with the second or third or any of the others, well except for the one on prohibition that one worked well didn’t it?
We need to follow the laws as they are written and not do the feel good new ideas the idiots in charge are thinking of enacting. If we just did what the laws we already have on the books tell us we must do it would weed out many of those nuts who do bad things with guns.
How about we admit the fact that anyone who commits a mass murder of any type is nuts? And those nuts shouldn’t have guns?
It is already in the law that anyone who is nuts can’t have a gun, how about we ENFORCE that law first and foremost.
Anyone wishing to buy a gun should have to go through a mental evaluation before ever being able to purchase a gun. But even then that will not stop those who really are not going to follow any law or nuts.
It is already against the law to commit murder.
It is already against the law to drive drunk.
It is already against the law to carry guns in a gun free zone.
People sometimes do not follow the laws, especially those with defective brains. New laws will not help us as far as guns, why? Because they only work after the fact.
After something bad has happened.
If people have a right to open carry as we still do here in Maine they should be allowed to, not hassled by the police when we do so. Unless you are brandishing said weapon.
As far as Sandyhook school incident goes I feel for everyone who was affected by that.
But putting new laws on the books against firearms ownership is not going to stop the nuts from doing something like this again. Nuts don’t follow laws in their mind they think what they are doing is right.
So the only answer is to put armed guards at every entrance to every “GUN FREE ZONE”
I mean we have armed air Marshalls.
Armed bank guards.
Secret service for the President.
So why not for schools and any other “Gun free zones” how else are you going to protect those in those places from someone nuts enough to cause harm to anyone with a gun.
And let’s be honest here, you have to be NUTS to commit a mass murder of any kind. Or maybe they are just listening to their god in their head talking to them.
Steve
The sad fact of the matter is that these acts of violence will continue no matter how many laws or prohibitions are passed. I don’t think anyone can argue that. You could put a GPS on every criminal and they will still break laws. We have a jail sitting empty amongst us. We all know that we have enough criminals to fill it. Maybe some efforts and anger should be focused on restoring the facilities to house them.
The second adendment rights was established to prevent the Federial Government from disarming state militia. The gun culture had nothing to do with the violence caused by the numeros shooting in the U.S. It happened because America has allowed the liberal leftist to remove God from every place in America. The underlining causes are: (1) Hollywood producing filth/violence (2) violent computer games (3) schools not teaching values (4) parents are not allowed to discipline their childrn (5) Liberals/Press ridiculing and attacking Christians/Jews because of their faith (6) Our society/government has created social and cultural foundations that eats the U.S. like a cancer. Don’t blame guns for America’s problems blame yourself. No, I don;t own a gun, but if one feels they need one let them have it.
Thank you Steve.My thoughts exactly
@snowball
Good Job! You were quickly derogatory and demeaning while avoiding the majority of what I said. Can you tell me what Nazi means? Loosely speaking, didn’t it stand for National Socialistic Party? Next Question: what do liberals and this President seem to be moving toward and supporting? Socialism. See the similarity. No, well, wouldn’t you say that the German people under the Nazis were under a form of government that controlled more and more of thier lives? Can you see that this government is moving toward controlling more and more of our lives? Did I call the President a Nazi or Hitler? No. (As a digression, both were relatively unknowns who had done little, yet were propelled to their government’s highest offices with and by a fanatical following. If you need an example of an Obama fanatic: Chris Matthews for Exhibit A).
Anywho… please carefully (and slowly, if necessary) reread my former post and this one, and then comment on all I had to say. Maybe then we could have a discussion. Unless… maybe you are like other liberals who hates letting the facts get in the way of an argument.
In the US, there are about 30,000 deaths each and every year by gunfire, about 10,000 of those deaths are homicides.
The Doonesbury strip is usually included in the editorial section of the newspaper.
The point they were making is that we responded with a ten plus year war, after 9/11 and the loss of about three thousand US citizens, incurring a major loss in life in our troops, and at an expense calculated into the trillions of dollars.
During those ten years of war, we continue to see nearly 30,000 gunfire deaths each year in the United States, and we can’t get beyond arguing over the right to bear arms.
We can argue all day, and all night about too many laws, or too few laws, not enough enforcement, or uneven enforcement of the laws, and we will not affect the deaths caused by gunfire.
Demand the data, and analysis of the data. After getting the data, take active steps to reduce deaths by gunfire.
Is that too much to ask for?
The following site attempts to document the homicides since and including Sandy Hook. Since and including Sandy Hook, we have had approximately 1516 homicides by gun in the United States.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/crime/2012/12/gun_death_tally_every_american_gun_death_since_newtown_sandy_hook_shooting.html
The problem is real, and it is our cultures, let us not ignore possible solutions for the next ten years.
@consider the consequences
The CDC says that in 2011, 31,940 people died from guns. 19,766 committed suicide, and 1,073 died from a combined accidental discharge and unknown intent. That leaves 11,101 for homicide. In 2010, 10,228 people were killed by drunk drivers. These numbers are very close, yet we do not have people calling for alcohol bans nor stricter drunk driving laws. Just a thought. Next a question. Would you please explain your solutions to ending gun violence?
Are you kidding me! Posting data from a twitter site? And you call this factual, or fact checking? You know what, you just reinforced the consistent problem we are experiencing in the US. We have quasi-political people media groups and ill-informed populace that tweet numbers as they see it and then send it out as facts to further their agenda. The new America, sit on you iPad and dictate mainstream, feel good prophecies.
The numbers you offer are meaningless without breaking it down, nor do you suggest anything other than, “…Demand the data, and analysis of the data. After getting the data, take active steps to reduce deaths by gunfire. Is that too much to ask for? Well if you would have looked further than this Blog, tweets and the Mainstream media falsies and past the cartoons, you would have your answers, and you either get it or not.
Using your numbers: “In the US, there are about 30,000 deaths each and every year by gunfire, about 10,000 of those deaths are homicides.”
Broken down as per FBI data (not your tweets & cartoons): US Gun Murders are down, 11,078 in 2010 or 3.50/100K, lowest rate since at least 1981; US Gun Aggravated Assault down, 138,336 in 2011 or 50.8/100K, lowest rate since at least 2004, conversely, Gun ownership is up, or 88.8 per 100 people in 2007 and 84 per 100 people in 2001.
Remember, Caution in using any single number as it does not tell the whole story.
I smell a Troll on this Blog.
Sorry for the data, but I wanted to state the Facts so we are on the same page:
Update: In 2011, an estimated 14,612 persons were murdered in the United States. This was a 0.7 percent decrease from the 2010 estimate, a 14.7 percent decline from the 2007 figure, and a 10.0 percent decrease from the 2002 estimate.
There were 4.7 murders per 100,000 inhabitants, a 1.5 percent decrease from the 2010 rate. Compared with the 2007 rate, the murder rate declined 17.4 percent, and compared with the 2002 rate, the murder rate decreased 16.8 percent. (See Tables 1 and 1A.)
Nearly 44 percent (43.6) of murders were reported in the South, the most populous region, 21.0 percent were reported in the West, 20.6 percent were reported in the Midwest, and 14.8 percent were reported in the Northeast. (See Table 3.)
And just to stay on point with the Bulldog article: “According to “FBI data”, only 2.6 percent of all murders in the U.S. are committed using a rifle of some kind. In 2011, there were 6,220 homicides with handguns and only 323 with rifles.”
Food for thought as we prepare for the town meeting.
What does the string of commas mean?
And how many of those rifle deaths were assault rifles or rifles with magazines over 10 round?
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=471922536196570&set=a.152219938166833.40496.133279166727577&type=1&ref=nf
Please check this and then ask your self.